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fate
Sept 16, 2007 16:27:29 GMT -5
Post by jonbroad87 on Sept 16, 2007 16:27:29 GMT -5
do you believe that your environment controls your decisions or that some higher being has already predetermined your life? Or do you believe you have ultimate free will and we make our own decisions and choices without being impacted by outside sources?
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fate
Sept 16, 2007 17:13:49 GMT -5
Post by dockirk on Sept 16, 2007 17:13:49 GMT -5
Both are true. We choose the probabilities that will frame our lives before we are born. Therefore, there are probabilities that are already set it motion. But - they are only probabilities. There is necessary randomness in the universe so that ANY outcome is POSSIBLE. But, not every outcome is PROBABLE.
Anyway - my 2 cents...
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fate
Sept 16, 2007 19:11:45 GMT -5
Post by jonbroad87 on Sept 16, 2007 19:11:45 GMT -5
So are you implying i choose the environment i will be born in? that in my opinion is the only way i can CHOOSE the probabilities that will frame my life before i am born.
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fate
Sept 17, 2007 21:59:33 GMT -5
Post by whitney on Sept 17, 2007 21:59:33 GMT -5
My two cents: the environment has the biggest impact on our decisions and we have a fair amount of free will to choose what effects us <strike>and our environment</strike> best. Some individuals may have complete free will, but leaving the environment out of any/all decisions would be difficult.
The idea of having some choice as to the probabilities that frame our life seems odd to me. I personally don't think it is possible to consciously choose the environment you are born into. And if it was possible, how far before conception would those decisions be made? I believe fetuses are sentient, but I'm not so sure about ova and sperm cells.
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fate
Sept 18, 2007 17:00:41 GMT -5
Post by dockirk on Sept 18, 2007 17:00:41 GMT -5
Of course its wierd - I'm talking about Reincarnation which is ignored in the West. I only suggest it as a possiblilitie because it seems to answer some of the problems that are considered so perplexing in the West such as "Why do some people sufffer more than others?" and "Why do bad things happen to good people?"
What if Westerners are wrong? What if we do live more than once? If so, it really would change priorities and worldview - think about it!
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fate
Sept 18, 2007 21:51:48 GMT -5
Post by whitney on Sept 18, 2007 21:51:48 GMT -5
Hey, I didn't say Westerners were right. I think their ideas are odd too.
The idea of reincarnation is interesting. It is possible that we have already experienced several different lives - that might impart some sort of personality aspect or tendency on us that effects the decisions we make in our current lives.
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redphil87
Noob
(I hate big business, and also you Jonathan!
Posts: 5
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fate
Sept 30, 2007 16:09:12 GMT -5
Post by redphil87 on Sept 30, 2007 16:09:12 GMT -5
I believe that we as humans are mostly free. While it is true that our environment and genetics are determined; we do choose how we react to these factors. For example, just because diabetes runs in someone's family, they do not have to become diabetic. If this person rations his or herself on sweets, then they will not get diabetes. These life decisions make who we are and what we will become. I also don't believe in fate or a predetermined plan for our lives. In order for such things to exist, there would have to be a prime mover(I.E. God). Since there is no conclusive proof of such a figure it is reasonable to assume that a predetermined plan or fate for that matter doesn't exist. Different factors such as life choices, chance, and circumstance cause the future. Therefore, we as humans are, as Sartre would say, condemned to be free.
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fate
Oct 5, 2007 20:53:06 GMT -5
Post by dockirk on Oct 5, 2007 20:53:06 GMT -5
You have made some assumptions about God here. You are assuming a Judeo-Christian human-like God. That is not the only option. Maybe God is something other than an "old man in the sky." Perhaps we choose our fates before we are born. Guess what? That makes US God!
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silas
Noob
"Since light travels faster than sound, people appear bright until you hear them speak."
Posts: 19
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fate
Oct 5, 2007 21:30:44 GMT -5
Post by silas on Oct 5, 2007 21:30:44 GMT -5
The question of self-determination versus destiny.
The only time in which a choice is possible is now, the present. Once a choice is made in the present, it moves into the past and becomes unchangeable and fixed. Things can only happen one way, so we can only make one choice. Therefore the future is destined in that we cannot choose to go to the movies, and choose to stay home at the same time. Only one of these can happen at any given time.
Did I choose to go to the movies, or were all factors (biological, social, emotional) affecting me in such a way that I could make no other choice? Was there in fact no choice at all?
Since that choice is now in the past, it is impossible for you to choose other than what you chose. The only situation that I can think of where it might be possible to see if someone would make a different choice based on the same input, is if we could erase memory so that they didn't remember that they had already made the choice. But in such a situation, is it even desirable that one make a different choice? I personally believe most of my decisions are based in logic, and logic should follow the same course every time. Logic does not operate upon the whims of biological, social, or emotional factors; logic is a reflection of the universe.
The fact that you cannot change decisions you have made (since they’re in the past), makes it seem as though it was destined to be the way it is. This may be true, but destiny did not deny choice. Choice confirmed destiny. One might even that choice created
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